HomeMy WebLinkAbout1983-02-09; Planning Commission; MinutesMeeting of:
Date of Nl!eting:
Time of Meetinq:
Place of Nl!eting:
CALL 'ID CRlER:
MINUTES
~ CXMUSSICN
Pl!truary 9, 1983
7:00 p.111.
City Council Chant>ers
'l'he meeting was called to order by Chairman Schlehuber at
7:01 p.m.
R:>LL CALL:
Present: Chairman Schlehuber, Vice-<:hairman
R:::l!tlotis, Cclllnissia,ers Marcus, Farrow, Jose,
Rawlins and Priestedt.
Absent: Ncne.
Staff fllelmers Present:
Michael Rob.miller, Land Use Planning Manager
Daniel Hentsch.ke, Assistant City Attorney
~ Kackley, City Engineer
PI.BOOE~ ALLmIN«::E was led by Chairman Schlehuber.
<llairman Schlehuber welcaned Roy Kackley, City Engineer, as
an Ex-Officio Melrber of the Planning Ccmnissicn.
PI..NfilKi CXMHSSICN PRJCID.JRES:
Chairman Schlehuber gave a sumnary of the Planning
COlllnissicn Procedure, as printed on the reverse side of
the Agenda, adding that speakers are requested to spell
their names for the reoord.
1. ZC-269, LlJSII: -Request for a zcne change fran R-1-~ to RlrM(O) (Residential Density -Multiple with a
()Jalified Ollerlay) for a 59.64 acre parcel generally
loalted near the northwest intersecticn of Avenida Encinas
and Poinsettia Lane adjacent to and east of the AT&SF
Railroad.
'1he GR)licant has requested another oontinuanoe en this
ital to the Petruary 23, 1983, meeting. 'lbere was no a,e
present to speak a, this item, so the Ccmnissicn granted
the requeet to oontinue.
2. ~ 82-17~6, ~ ~CN -Request for a
148-lot iuEd at 1ooited awroxliiiately ooe mile east of
Kl calno Real at the wetem terminus of Sumy Creek~
in the R-E acne.
Nike 801alller, 1Mld use Planning Manager, gave an
a1ditianal rwpoct on this proposed project, taking up where
they left off at the Ja1uary 26, 1983, l'lleeting. It appeared
to atatt that the 0:-i•donera lilted the project, rut the
pratlll.--1'hether it •t the intent of the R-B 2Xne. 'lbe atatt oat up with tht'M alternatiW!tlz
1) To have a acne change and actually re-zcne the
prcperty out of the R-! acne and d\9\g8 it to saie
other acne.
Schlehuber X
loltlotis X
Marcus X
Farrow X
Jose X X
Rawlins X
Friestedt X
MINUTES
PIJRU?«; CXMUSSI~ February 9, 1983 Paqe 2
If the Camlissial decided to pursue that alternative, the
decisial would be to deny the project and refer it to the
Council with the denial and a recomnendatial, also, that a
zcne change be initiated.
2) To oonsider a za,e code amendnent, where the R-
E zcne would be looked at, together with the
developnent standards, and consider whether those
should be changed to allow a project like this
with the trade-off being cama, ~ space.
Similar to the first, if the Ccmnissial opted for that, they
'WOUld deny the project and refer it to the Council with a
rea:mnendat ial for za,e oode amendnent to change the
standards.
3) If the Camlissial found the project as proposed
to be a good project and used the flexibility
provided under the planned developnent process,
they CX>Uld find the project meets the intent of the
R-E zcne and wouldn't require zooe changi~ or zcne
oode ane'ldina, and indicatinq that the PUD process
allowed this flexibility.
If the Camlissial did opt for that alternative, this
project would be referred back to staff for conditioos of
~roval and fa:warded to the Council with a reronmendatial
for approval.
Since the last meeting the aR)licant has cme in and revised
their plan (thinking the Ccmnissial might opt for the third
alternative) and it cnrplies with the mininum criteria set
down ~ staff: basically, any lots that didn't froot al the
golf <X>Urse or have the advantage of open space, would be at
least cne acre. 'nle applicant brought in a new plan and
that map was referred to, with Bill Hofman showing the
changes oo the new wall map. However, staff had not
review.d this map in detail and requested the opportunity
to sti:.dy it and place conditials al it.
One change that was made was the public road, which was
oowngraded to a road easement. 'lllat could be taken care of
in the conditioos of tg>rOVal.
Another wall map was used to show the off-site circulatial
fer the proposed project.
ec.dssiooer Jose asked for clarificatial of the se<XX'ld
altemative and did he understand oorrectly that
h ,GAlllMlided denial wit.hoot prejudice and a zooe oode
aeidllent, leaving the R-E 200e, but reducing the
requirements fer R-E.
Mike HOlzadller answered that was oorrect and maybe the
IJOne could be changed to say sanething like the lots have
to be the mini.a.In ooe to four acres, but with cxnna1 open
apeoe as an altemative, the lot sizes <X>Uld be reduced.
'11le staff would like to have an answer al that policy
cp!Stiat.
Ocaliaaiooer Prieetedt asked whether the applicant had done
anything ot:her than the new map, and Bill Hofman answered
that,.. the ooly new presentatial.
MINUTES
PLNfin«; <XMUSSIOI February 9, 1983
O\airman Schlehuber mentioned there were sane problems with
80111! of the lots oo the new fflllP , but th06e were details
that oould be woned out later.
ec.dssioner lbltx>tis CXllffllented that the Ccmnissioo had not
reviewed this new map, except as it ~red on the wall.
O\airman Schlehuber opened the public hearing at 7: 16 p.m.
and issued the invitatioo to speak.
Den Agatep, 2956 loleevelt, Carlsbad, representing the
IIR)licant, adl!ressed the Ccrmliss ioo. ~ stated they had
tried to present to the staff and the :cmnissioo a
subdivisioo they fel t met the minim.un standards outlined by
the staff at the last hearing, with all lots not fronting
the cpen sapoes being one acre in size. 'nley had not
attenpt:ed to oonpletely red:> the project in that two-week
period and he used the graphic to show the changes.
Mr.Agatep explained that there was a misunderstanding at the
last hearing about the golf course beinq "SE!llli-public". It
was never their i ntent ioo to have this a "semi-public"
project, but call)let ely private, with rurally ~roved
private streets, not precl uding access for public services.
'lbere would be a gate t o the west and it would be a
controlled CClfflllnity.
Cclllnissioner Marcus asked when the golf course would be
built and Mr. Agatep answered i t would be in the first
phase and guaranteed as to maintenance. It was not i ust a
pranise fer the future.
Dorothy EJ:right, 5855 Slll"I";: Creek lbad, Carlsbad, addressed
the Camdssioo, urging tt,em not to change the zcning and not
to lower the lot sizes. She fel t that area is a rural ar.?a
that should not be c:hangl!d and should be similar to Rancho
Santa Fe and not a stan&:rd subdi visioo-type of
developnent.
~rt Sonneborn, 3985 Stella f'laris , Carls bad, addressed
the camdasioo, restating whee he said at the last
hearing, that this developne11t "'°'-lld be an excellent
aMitioo to the area, it is well-planned and could not
poaibly daage the neighbors' properties, and no cne else
'°11.d have the naiey or the courage to propose this type of
dewlc)laent.
'1be oc-daaioo re<X)IJ'\ized Russell Grosse, 5850 Sumy Creek
~. carlllbad, lh> stated he would like a Rancho Santa Fe
type of area, but that could never hawe,i in that area. He
felt if thia project did not go through, there "'°'1ld be a
r;,c.eibility of. a developer holding the property nine or ten
yean, until th.tre is a higller density of populatioo, and
then putting in• lees desirable subdivisioo. He felt the pf ooune oou1d pneant a problem, in the event the
~n did not aaintain it and the course became
pmlic. 'lht golf <XlUrae should not beoane public, but
lhculd naain cipa1 apace, such as a park. As Mr Grosse had
---' in the l•t hearing, if the aetbedts were maintai ned
and the lou WA wide emugh, in driving through the
aabdiriaia\, you l«IUld feel you were in a rural area.
MINUTES
P~CDIIISS~ February 9, 1983
Jim Hagaman,5320 SUmy Creek Road, Carlsbad, !!poke to the
Camdssiai, reaffirming the positiai he took at the last
hearing, in ~itiai to the proposed developnent. It
<bes not rrcel: the intent of the R-E zone. He felt the R-E
zone designatiai was f~t for and should remain the way
it was set up. He felt the policy should be followed and
not chanqed and the property owners should be able to
c.hooee the land uee. He objected to the grading, stating
that it was not the intent of the RL designatiai in the
General Plan. He stated his main objection was the
character of the pro1ect and not particularly the c1ensity.
In a discussiai vith ca.missioner Raltx>tis ab:>ut the
grading, he said he would not object if the project met
the intent of the zone.
Camdssioner Jose stated he understood the road would not be
guttered and rurt>ed to maintain a rural flavor. 'fflis was
the aily llrell left foe this type of dl!velopnent and if it
were done otherwise, they would destroy what they had set
~ when the R-E zone was adopted.
In a discussiai between Cornnissioner Rontx:>tis and Mr.
Haganan, they agreed the right-of-way was maintained by
the City and they would have the privilege of developinq it
at a future ti.me.
Olase H. Canan, 5855 Sumy Creek Rollld,Carlsbad, spoke in
~itiai to the propor-;!d project. Mr.Canan had written ~.
letter to Mr. Jose, and a copy of the letter was
distributed to the Cornnissiai.
Banning Cantarini, 905 Laguna Drive, Carlsbad, addressed
the Cornnission, stating they have owned land there for
nearly fift • years, and their land is where the road would
go, and they want to go on record as being for the
developnent. 1'ley have been land-locked all these years
and would be delighted to have relief fran that situatiai.
Norman Arndt, the Engineer who worked ai the tentative map
before the camdssiai, spoke in favor of the project. He
felt it met the intent of the R-E zone, as the streets are
designed with a lot of sensitivity to the enviraiment and
the qrading is minimized as nuch as it ever CX>Uld be. He
felt it was irrportant to oonsider this would be a planned
camwuty. tllel"I you drive through the County and see where
builders have graded a pad and then planted ioe plant, it
certainly doesn't look natural. Usually the upceep is
diffiC'Ult ai thoae lots and eventually the maintenance
falls apart. He felt this plM deserved a lot of credit.
Ida Kato, 3250 SUmy Creek Road, Carlsbad, addressed
the Ocadsaiai, and stated she was against the project the
Wfl'/ it is now.
Since no one else wished to speak ai this matter, Chairman
Schlehuber: cloae!1 the public testinaly at 7:47 p.m.
ca.niuimer Marcus restated what she had said at the last
hearing, that the project <bes not meet the intent of the R-
B acne and ahe cannot support it. Also, she stated she had
not revi.-d the new 11111p.
@
MINUTES
PLMND«; <DIIISSIOf February 9, 1983 Page 5
Olainan Sdllehuber stated he felt it did not meet the R-E
acne requir-...nts, but felt there had b@en a good
diecuaaioo m the project this evening. It is a good
project:., but this is just a concept. He stated he could
support the oonoept, but not the project as it is now.
OJai .. iawr Joae agreed with Chairnian Schlehuber and
Cnaiuiawr Marcue and ad&!ci the golf oourse, itself,
would deetroy the natural habitat.
Oolaiaaimer Acllb>t.is felt the R-E zone had proved to be
iq,opular ae such, and he noted that approxiNtely half of
the people St.JA)Ol"ting th is project were people who had
originally wrked oo the R-E zone. He liked the project and
supported it,• the density is low and the grading is
ndniNl and cloee to the contours, but felt naybe
alternative two would be the W'1f!/ to go.
'ltle Calllliuim paeaed a 111>tioo to deny, without prejudice,
the plan ae preeented, because it does not ~t the terms
of the exi11t l.ng R-E zone. However, the camdssim found
that the applicant had presented a quality oonoeptual plan
that would allow an estate-type <Xlllllllnity similar to
the Rancberoa project presently in the City of Carlsbad. It
IIOUl.d 8P.)Mr to the ea.iuioo that a concept as presented
IIOUl.d be a nore viable estate setting than~ plnns that
oould be preee,ted under the existing R-E zone: therefore,
the camdssioo ru:acae..ded the amenttnent of the existing R-
E zone to ac."CXlll)lish this purpose.
N1!lf P{ELIC HBARn03:
3. aJP-225 SZECIJAN GAJlll!NS, n«:. -.Request for approval
of a ciiidltlaia! uge permit to allow the sale of al<Xlholic
beverages at a proposed restaurant in an existing building
in West Bluff Plaza.
Clutrles Gri.nln gave the presentation as oontai .ed in the
staff report, with the aid of a transparency.
Olaiman Schlehuber opened the public hearing at 8:05 p.m.
and iaaued the invitatioo to speak. Since no one wished to
speak oo this matter, the public testirraly was ooncluded.
Oonliasicner Farrow m1Mtimed the parking requirements
and Charles Gria answered staff felt the parking was
aquate for this type of use. Cc.-duioner Farrow also
queetimed the uae of the weeding •necessary er desirable
for the develqaant of the oonamity• in the analysis
eectioo. After a discusaioo, it was agreed, this aould
readt •we believe it is not detrimental to the developllent ot the 00IIIIIWU. ty ••
'!be Plaming CClaiaaion ~ the Negative Declaratioo
filed by the Laid Use Plaming Manager and adopted the
f.ollowing Rseolutioo:
~ ti>. 2077, AS MIH>l!D, APPJOVI?«; A
ailSmaW. UBI Pillitrr 'ro WO, 'fflE 5"LB OF
NDBX,IC-BBVBR1tGBS AT A PlllPOOBI> RESTAUlWff IN
IB1l' BWPP PLAZA.
Schlehuber
lolbotis
Marcus
Farrow
Joae
Rawlins
Friestedt
Schlehuber
lblbotis
l4aral8
Farrow
Joae
Rawlins
Frieetedt
X X
X
X
X
X
X
X
X
X
X X
X
X
X
X
MINUTES
February 9, 1983 Page 6
4. SP-185bZC-264, ~ -Request for a zone change
fro111 R--1-1 ,000 to R-P, CT and ~ and a specific plan oo 96
acres oo the south side of El Camino Real east of El Camino
RNl.
Olarles Grinln gave the presentatioo oo this item, using the
overhead projector to show the locatioo of the site, as
oontained in the staff report. A new Resolutioo with
changes in findings under environmental sectioo and adding
80llle findings for the dual zooing was distriooted to the
camdssioo prior to the meeting.
camdssimer Friestedt asked if there were any existing
creek management plans in the County similar to the one
being prop:>aed in this specific plan and Charles Grinm
answered not that he knew of. 'ltais plan was designed fran
one in Orange County. camdssioner Friestedt thought this
was a lot of additiooal work and extra planning anc, wcndered
if it were necessary.
OlaiI1111ln Schlehuber opened the public hearing at 8:25 p.m.
and issued the invitatioo to speak.
Nick Banche, 702 -4th Street, Oceanside, addressed the
camdssioo, stating this ~licatioo is not an actioo plan
and thev will return later with the developnent plans.
Jerry Elder, 7241 lbnero Drive, La Jolla, addressed
the camdssioo, and stated he was not speaking for or
against the request, oot did have a CX>Uple of ooncems that
will cane up in the later stages. He requested an
~unity to look over th,, precise plan and expressed
oonoern with the height of the ooildinqs as well as the
treatlllent of the roofs. Also, he was oa,cerned with the
grading and aligrnent of Marra\ !aid. He felt it would be
difficult to place the road because of the verti cal curve
of the road as shown. It wouldn't allow for nuch pad
space. Otherwise he hoped to wor:k with the ~licant oo the
project.
camdssioner Farrow asked Mr. Elder what his oa,oern
involved regarding the roof tq,s and Mr.ader replied that
sane CC11111ercial building, have air oonditicning uni.t8,
elevator-shaft equipant and other clutter m the roof and
since hi& property overlooks this site, they would be
concerned with a view that did not include such clutter.
om Hickethier, Vice-President, South Coast Asphalt
Pr0&1cts, <:arlabad, addressed the Qalissioo in suppoct of
this project and of the za,e change. Re cmaented that m
page two of the Specific Plan it states they are going to
develop the entire 86. 73 acres as open ~and, of oouree, that should be 36.15 acres for developaent and so
acr:ee of open space.
Mr. Hickethier requested to go oo record for: South Coast as
being 0R)08ed to the develop1ent of Rancho oel Oro if it
nquina going through South Coast property. 'ltais is their
present poaitioo, but that might change at a later date.
Since no one elae wished to speak oo this matter, the
plblic teetilllcny was closed at 8:33 p.m.
MINUTES
February 9, 1983
camdssiooer Jose conplimented both the awlicant and staff
for providing the camtissioo with such a conplete package,
and expressed regret that they couldn't wait until the
circulatioo element was conpleted to know whether Rancho del
Oro would '}(.' ~hrough or not. He called attentioo to page 6
of the Specific Plan, Item 13, where the word "laboratories"
appears and requested this word be deleted or an asteridc
placed there. He stated too many times laboratories have
not abided by ~latioos, and the enviravnent has suffered
fran this. Mr. GrinlTI suggested the word "incidental" be
added before laboratories to preclude any problem with
this.
'1'he following Resolutioos were acl:>pted:
REOOU11'I~ Kl. 2079, N3 AMENDED, RECXMIENDJN; APPMVAl. OF A ZCNE Qim;E FI01 R-1-10,000 'ID CT(O)
RP-( 0) Ml) 00 ~ PRJPERl'Y GENERALLY IOCATm 00 'lllE
&Xmf SIDE OF HIGHWI\Y 78 BE'IWEEN 'lllE no HAYMM
£JUVE aJL-DEl-SACS •
REOOU11'I~ Kl. 2080, N3 AMENDED, RECXMIENDJN;
APPR)VAL OF sii=fss, N3 AMENDED, FOR A 96.6 ACRE
'IOORIST/CXMIERCIAL/OFFICE,/tPm SPN:E AREA CM:RAILY
I.DCATED BE'lWEEN 'lllE no aJir-DEl-SACS MADE BY
HAYMAR.
Disa:ESIOO I'lDIS:
5. l?Clr41 -OORIOI -Request for a Planning Camri.ssioo
determinatioo toTncrease the height of a retaining wall
to 16 feet a1 property located at the northwest oorner of
Isle Drive and Hillside Drive in the R-1 zaie.
Bill Hofman used a transparency to show the planned wall
and gave the presentatioo as oontained in the staff report.
Cl\airman Schlehuber cx:mnented therf" 1,JQUld also be a six
foot fence at the frcrat of the building toward the street.
cannissiooer Rawlins queetiooed whether this wall had been
engineered as a retaining wall for the dirt and Bill Hofman
answered the IIR)lioant claimed it was designed to retain
the dirt and without the wall there is a chance of the dirt
sliding with the next heavy rainfall. camdssiooer Rawlins
felt it IIOU.ld not hold, but agreed the 1.1pplicant would have
to get a buildinc;i permit and that would have to meet
certain specificatialS.
ChairNn Schlehuber c:p!l'led the public testim:ny at 8:41
p.11., mid since no ~ wished to speak, closed the public
teatbmy.
'11W following Reeol.utioo was adopted:
lalCU11'~ Kl. 2078, APPIUl,1Il«; A ~ 'ro diiifiik'r A 16-iiffir RBTAIND«; NUL 00 PRJPERl'Y
GIIIBMLLY UlC\ftD Kr 'l'HB t«>Rl'HWBST oor<NER OF ISLE
CIUVB NI> HILLSIDE DRIVE
Schlehuber
R::rrb:>tis
Marcus
Farrow
Jose
Rawlins
Friestedt
Sdllehuber
loltx>tis
Marcus
Farrow
Joae
Rawlins
Friestedt
X
X
X
X X
X
X
MINUTES
PLARmC CDl4ISSIOI February 9, 1983
'11le Minutes of the January 12, 1983, meeting were approved
as presented.
camlissioner Rarbotis requested staff to give the
camlissioo a ncnthly progress report a, itE!lll3 the Planning
camlissioo had sent to Council.
~=
By proper notioo, the Jt,geting of February 9, 1983, was
adjourned at 8:43 p.m.
Respectfully sutmitted,
MICJAEL J. lblf.M:tLLBQ/
Land Use Planning MaMger
Harriett Babbitt, Minutes Clerk
Schlehuber
lbrbotis
Marcus
Farrow
Jose
Rawlins
Friestedt
X
X
X
X
X X
X
X