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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1988-10-19; Planning Commission; MinutesMeeting of: MINUTES PLANNING COMMISSION Time of Meeting: 6:00 p.m. Date of Meeting: October 19, 1988 % 4 Place of Meeting: City Council Chambers \ COMMISSIONERS ’ CALL TO ORDER: Chairman McFadden called the Meeting to order at 6:02 p.m. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE was led by Chairman McFadden. ROLL CALL: Present - Chairman McFadden, Commissioners Erwin, Holmes, Marcus, Schlehuber, and Schramm Absent - Commissioner Hall Staff Members Present: Charles Grimm, Assistant Planning Director Gary Wayne, Senior Planner Brian Hunter, Associate Planner Bobbie Hoder. Senior Management Analyst Phil Carter, Assistant to the City Manager Ron Ball, Assistant City Attorney David Hauser, Assistant City Engineer Steve Jantz, Associate Civil Engineer PLANNING COMMISSION PROCEDURES: Chairman McFadden reviewed the Planning Commission procedures on the overhead for the benefit of the audience. Commissioner Schlehuber arrived at 6:07 p.m. COMMENTS FROM THE AUDIENCE ON ITEMS NOT LISTED IN THE AGENDA: There were no comments from the audience. Commissioner Erwin requested that Item #4 on the agenda be heard immediately after Item #l since the majority of spectators were present for Item t4. Motion was duly made, seconded, and carried to move Item #4 on the agenda to be heard as the first public hearing item. CONTINUED DISCUSSION ITEM: 1) Extension of SDP 87-5 GALLUCCI - Approval of a one year extension of Site Development Plan to build two condominiums located on the east side of Garfield Street north of Chinquapin Avenue, Local Facilities Management Plan Zone 1. Charles Grimm, Assistant Planning Director, reviewed the background of the request and stated that this item was continued from the last meeting because there was some question that the property had changed ownership and there was no property disclosure form filed by the new owner. The applicant has now submitted this disclosure form. Chairman McFadden inquired if the public facilities agreement goes with the land or the applicant. Ron Ball, Assistant City Attorney, replied that the agreement goes with the land and is normally paid at the time of issuance of building permits. Erwin Holmes Marcus McFadden Schlehuber Schramm ‘. i f- T MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page 2 COMMISSIONERS Thomas Notey, 1831 Deerhill Trail, Topanga, California, applicant, addressed the Commission and stated that he is the new owner of the property and, as such, needs additional time to obtain financing and submit plans. Chairman McFadden opened the public testimony and issued the invitation to speak. There being no persons desiring to address the Commission on this topic, Chairman McFadden declared the public testimony closed and opened the item for discussion among the Commission members. Motion was duly made, seconded, and carried to adopt Resolution No. 2778 approving the extension of SDP 87-5 for one year based on the findings and subject to the conditions contained therein. PUBLIC HEARINGS: 4) LOCAL FACILITIES MANAGEMENT PLAN ZONE 22 - Request approval of the Local Facilities Management Plan for Zone 22 on property generally located south of Palomar Airport Road, West of I-5, and north of Batiquitos Lagoon. Phil Carter, Assistant to the City Manager, began the staff report and stated that the presentation would include a brief introduction to the zone plan, the background and zone overview, compliance with Proposition E. Somewhat different than the other zone plan presentations, this report will primarily review those four facilities in Zone 22 which require special attention. Assisting him will be Brian Hunter and Steve Jantz who have been responsible for the preparation of the plan. He will conclude the staff report with the financing plan for Zone 22. Brian Hunter stated that LFMP Zone 22 is located in the southwest quadrant of Carlsbad as shown on the overhead exhibit. It consists of a largely undeveloped land west of Interstate 5, south of Palomar Airport Road, east of the Pacific Ocean, and north of Batiquitos Lagoon. The land uses are mixed. Of the zone's 420 total acreage, 50.8 acres are residential, 61.6 acres are mixed use residential/office, 33.1 acres are travel service/mixed use residential, and residential General Plan uses include 52.1 acres of open spaces, 32.8 acres of office, 22.7 acres of travel service/commercial, 4.2 acres of travel service, and six acres of planned industrial. The remainder of the zone is circulation elements and railroad right-of-way. The buildout projection for this zone is consistent with the methodology contained in the 1986 citywide facilities and improvements plan and the provisions of Proposition E which was approved by the citizens of Carlsbad on November 4, 1986. The facilities analysis indicated that the only existing shortfall in this zone was Parks. Parks Similar to Zone 20, there is presently a 4.24 acre shortfall of park facilities in the southwest quadrant of the city. That shortfall is projected to be taken care of by the Pacific Rim project's dedication of 24.25 acres and Erwin Holmes Marcus McFadden Schlehuber Schramm ‘1 . r‘ \ MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page improvement of 15 acres along with a five acre improvement which is required of Zone 20. In keeping with that same time scenario which allows development to occur through 1992, then a 4.4 acre dedication of park facilities in Zone 22 is required. Steve Jantz continued the presentation. Circulation The existing circulation network which runs through Zone 22 currently meets the adopted performance standard. However, as development occurs within the zone and adjacent to the zone, certain circulation facilities will require upgrading: (a) In 1989, Avenida Encinas from Palomar Airport Road to Poinsettia Lane, including intersection improvements at Avenida Encinas/Palomar Airport Road and Avenida Encinas/Poinsettia Lane. (b) In 1990, Palomar Airport Road Overpass falls below the standard and needs mitigation. (c) In 1993, the Poinsettia Lane interchange will be required to be upgraded. This will also include the road segment of Poinsettia between the I-5 and Avenida Encinas. (d) In 1995, Palomar Airport Road between Avenida Encinas/Carlsbad Boulevard and Poinsettia Lane between Avenida Encinas/Carlsbad Boulevard. Prior to the recordation of the first final map, or issuance of building permit or grading permit, the developers are required to submit to the City a financing mechanism guaranteeing the construction of these facilities. Drainage Zone 22 is broken up into two drainage sub-basins. Half of the zone drains north and the other half drains south. A drainage problem has been identified in the Ponto area. The Plan proposes a series of storm drain facilities which will pick up drainage from the zone and run parallel to the railroad right-of-way through a proposed desiltation basin along the north shore of the Batiquitos Lagoon. Prior to any development within this drainage sub-basin, a financing mechanism guaranteeing construction of the storm drain will be required prior to development within the zone. Brian Hunter continued the presentation. Open Space On August 9, 1988 the City Council adopted interim ordinance #NS31 regarding open space. That ordinance creates a 15-member citizen's committee to review the current open space plan. The Planning Commission, by Minute Motion on August 17, 1988, recommended that the criteria for determining performance standard open space should be further defined. Development projects will be reviewed for conformance to current policies at the time of discretionary action. Mr. Hunter asked Commissioners to look at LFMP i/22 using present day scenarios which will not lock exhibits into place. The policies which exist at the time of discretionary action for site development plans, plat maps, etc. will be applied at the time discretionary permits are issued. LFMP f/22 has been conditioned so as not to adopt the open space exhibits as they appear in the plan. Phil Carter continued the presentation. ‘. i f- -1 MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page 4 COMMISSION Financing This zone plan, like the previous plan, contains a specific financing section which identifies funding options which are available for each of the 11 facilities shown in the plan. The zone plan does not lock in the specific financing since it allows those options most appropriate to each one of the facilities. This is the same financing matrix seen in previous zone plans. Recommended Modifications to LFMP iI22 Mr. Carter reviewed a memo dated October 19, 1988 to the Planning Commission recommending a revised condition to the Circulation and Drainage sections of LFMP 1122. The recommended revision states that "Prior to recordation of the first final map, issuance of a grading permit or issuance of a building permit, whichever occurs first, for any development in Zone 22, a comprehensive financing program...." This revised condition would replace the existing condition on pages 16 and 103 of the Circulation section and page 86 of the Drainage section which states that "Prior to the approval (or issuance) of any development permit within Zone 22, a comprehensive financing program...." In addition, staff recommended deletion of a sentence on page 140 of the Phasing section which states that the projections in LFMP iI22 are for planning purposes only. Mr. Carter concluded the presentation by stating that LFMP iI22 complies with the growth management program and staff recommends approval. Commissioner Erwin inquired if there is a down side to the revised condition contained in the October 19th memo. Mr. Carter replied that there was none. Commissioner Erwin referred to Exhibit 51 on page 116 regarding the 50 ft. landscape setback and inquired if this was the example which was referred to which implies no acceptance on the part of the City. Mr. Hunter replied that this was correct and that it also implies no taking by the City. Chairman McFadden opened the public testimony and issued the invitation to speak. Marv Stedman, 5897 Overland Drive, San Diego, Vice President of the Lusk Company and Manager of the San Diego Division, applicant, addressed the Commission and stated that they concur with the staff presentation and recommendation. He expressed appreciation to staff for their hard work on this plan. Chairman McFadden inquired how many of the 40 property owners in this zone participated in the input to LFMP #22. Mr. Stedman replied that, to his knowledge, most of the owners participated in the discussions. Mr. Carter added that at a meeting following the rough draft of the plan, all of the property owners were present. Pat O'Day, 7585 Navigator Circle, Carlsbad, addressed the Commission and stated that he is part owner of a nine acre parcel in Zone 22 (Property #2, Exhibit 51). He mentioned 3 ;. f” ‘7 MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page 5 the scheme for open space determination and the fact that each individual project will be required to comply with current requirements, per his letter to the Planning Commission dated October 19, 1988. He expressed appreciation to staff for their hard work on this plan. Ted Blonski, 17065 West Bernard0 Drive, San Diego, addressed the Commission and stated that he is in favor of the Commission approval of LFMP 1122. He has attended several of the meetings which were held and commended staff on their hard work. His property is located at the north end of the zone, just south of Palomar Airport Road. There being no other persons desiring to address the Commission on this topic, Chairman McFadden declared the public testimony closed and opened the item for discussion among the Commission members. Commissioner Erwin stated that he can support the plan, however he has a problem with Finding #5. He does not like the words "prevent growth" and would like the finding reworded. Mr. Carter replied that the intent of Finding #5 is that no growth will be allowed in Zone 22 unless the performance standard is met. Staff can accept a rewording. Mr. Carter suggested that the finding could read, "The Local Facilities Management Plan for Zone 22 will ensure that the public facilities and services are available in conformance with the adopted performance standards prior to allowing any growth to occur." Commissioner Erwin was satisfied with the rewording. Commissioner Schlehuber referred to page 86, Drainage, and stated that the staff memo dated October 19th contained a typographical error on the actual wording of the existing condition as it pertained to the Drainage section. Chairman McFadden likes the plan. She has a question on the Park prior agreement. Without understanding all of the technicalities in regard to that, she can accept the plan for this zone because of Condition E (page 13) which states that periodic adjustments will be made. Motion was duly made, seconded, and carried to adopt Resolution No. 2780 recommending approval of the Negative Declaration issued by the Planning Director and adopt Resolution No. 2781 recommending approval of Local Facilities Management Plan for Zone 22, with the change on Resolution No. 2781 to reword Finding i/5 as read by Mr. Carter, and the modifications to page 16 and 103 (Circulation), page 86 (Drainage), and page 140 (Phasing) per staff memo dated October 19, 1988. RECESS The Planning Commission recessed at 6:37 p.m. and reconvened at 6:42 p.m. 2) SDP 88-3 CARLTAS AUTO CENTER - Request for approval of a Site Development Plan to construct an auto retail center in the C-2-Q Zone and also in Local Facilities Management Plan Zone 3. Charles Grimm, Assistant Planning Director, reviewed the background of the request and stated that the applicant is Erwin Holmes Marcus McFadden Schlehuber Schramm COMMISSIONERS ‘. ;. ,P MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page f~ COMMISSIONERS requesting approval of a Site Development Plan on 3.7 acres to construct an automobile-oriented retail shopping center and restaurant on the south side of the Cannon Road extension, east of Paseo de1 Norte. The present zoning is C-2-Q. The project falls under Specific Plan 19(C). He reminded Commissioners that in December 1987 they approved several other items regarding the Car Country expansion which included a tentative map, a specific plan, and a LCP amendment. This project is part of the development which was approved under that specific plan. As proposed, the project would involve approximately 37,900 sq. ft. of auto retail including tire sales, tune-up shops, brake shops, etc. and a future 4,500 sq. ft. restaurant at the northeast corner of the site. The architecture is Spanish motif, consistent with the existing Car Country and the expansion, with a variety of relief features. The project is proposed to be in three buildings: Bldg. A is the primary building with 33,000 sq. ft. and includes general retail facing out towards Cannon Road. The back of Bldg. A and Bldg. B forms a small auto courtyard for the various uses such as auto service. Bldg. B has approximately 4,900 sq. ft. and contains several drive through bays. The third building will be a restaurant at a later date. Staff had concerns with the grading because it requires an import of 7,500 yds. of soil to level the site. Due to the high visibility, the leveling of the pad does make a better design and enables the auto bays to be screened somewhat. There will also be a wall along Cannon Road as well as landscaping. There are 198 parking spaces provided. Since this is a unique use, it is not known if the parking will be adequate. The restaurant has been conditioned so that parking can be reevaluated at the time approval is requested. All other aspects of the project meet or exceed the requirements, and staff recommends approval. Commissioner Erwin is concerned about the storage of hazardous materials. Mr. Grimm replied that staff has proposed several conditions on this item. Commissioner Erwin inquired about the two underground tanks which appear to be located in a common area where no one is responsible, and where anything could be dumped. He understands that if the tanks become contaminated, it is the landlord's liability. He would like to see some responsibility by the largest tenant with the tanks under lock and key. He believes a receipt program should be initiated. Otherwise, he foresees a problem. Chairman McFadden inquired how many hazardous materials storage tanks of this type do we have in Carlsbad, and what types of violations have we encountered. Mr. Grimm replied that he was unable to answer. Commissioner Marcus inquired if a procedure to install locks and keys should rightfully be part of the resolution, and if this is something the Planning Commission should be involved with. She was under the impression that this is the responsibility of the County. Chairman McFadden inquired if the hazardous waste tanks meet County specifications. Mr. Grimm replied that the County stipulates the hazardous waste requirements; the tanks will be inspected and regulated by the County. ‘, :. r -, MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page 7 COMMISSION Commissioner Schramm inquired if posting is required as to what can be put in the tanks. Mr. Grimm replied that it would be similar to that of a service station--primarily petroleum products. He is unsure of what the County requires. Commissioner Holmes is concerned that the tanks are completely surrounded by buildings and there are few regulations on this situation. He would like to see Mike Smith from the Fire Department approve the design and location of the tanks. Ron Ball, Assistant City Attorney, replied that Commissioners are entering a field which is preempted by the County and State. The matter of disposal of toxic wastes and substances is between the disposer and the County. This condition does require approval of the Fire Department, which is permissible. Commissioner Schlehuber is glad to know that there is someone regulating this problem because he is aware of incidents of tank leakage. He is concerned that Carlsbad doesn't get involved too closely because it would expose the City to possible liability; he feels the responsibility should belong to the County. Chairman McFadden is satisfied with the comment by the City Attorney. Commissioner Erwin would like to see a recommendation made to the developer since he will ultimately be liable, according to the County. Chairman McFadden replied that this could be done by Minute Motion, although it is out of our jurisdiction. Commissioner Marcus referred to Condition 1148 on page 8 and asked if this should read, "The developer shall provide the City Fire Department with a reproducible..." Staff concurred. Mr. Grimm also noted that on the handout memorandum from staff to the Planning Commission dated October 19, 1988 the first condition should read "11" rather than "1." Chairman McFadden opened the public testimony and issued the invitation to speak. John White, Carltas Company, 4401 Manchester, Suite 206, Encinitas, addressed the Commission and stated that Carltas is the developer of the Car County expansion and the company is owned by the Paul Ecke family. He appreciates the hard work which was done by staff on this project. Carltas agrees with the staff report and is pleased with the final design of the project which has attempted to screen vehicle and service bays. He believes the project meets a need in Carlsbad. He requested permission to address two conditions after the architect has spoken. Tom Awbrey of Krommenhoek/McKeown & Associates, 1550 Morena, San Diego, architect, addressed the Commission and stated that this was a challenging project. He reviewed the project design and the attempts to landscape and screen the service areas from the public. Commissioner Erwin inquired about the placement of the lunch area which looks directly into the service bays. Mr. Awbrey \ : /p MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page 8 replied that the lunch area is stepped down so that it does not look directly into the service area. Chairman McFadden inquired what will be seen from I-5. Mr. Awbrey replied that a study from I-5 was not done--only from Cannon Road. Trees will screen the majority of the west side. Commissioner Erwin inquired how long it will take for the trees to grow to the size depicted in the renderings. Mr. Awbrey replied that it would take approximately ten years. John White, Carltas, returned to the podium, and stated that: (1) He is concerned about the revision to Condition l/l1 on the staff memo of October 19th relating to the parking study for the restaurant. He would like to see the reference to 100% occupancy reduced to 85% occupancy. (2) Carltas will meet all of the hazardous waste requirements; he doesn't feel the Commission should be concerned about this matter. The waste material on this site will be the same as any other gas station/auto center in the City. (3) He would like to request deletion of the condition regarding overnight parking on page two of the staff memo of October 19th. He feels there may be times when people will need to leave a vehicle at night for servicing the next day, and that the landscaping should camouflage it. He feels this condition is unreasonable and is not a condition of other local service stations. Chairman McFadden inquired how many cars can be stored in the bays. Mr. White replied that he doesn't know yet what the exact usage will be. He prefers to park vehicles on the cul-de-sac so that it will not interfere with vehicle movement within the courtyard, however he would like the ability to park vehicles in the courtyard overnight. Chairman McFadden realizes that transmission work could possibly take more than one day but feels that the vehicle should be stored inside the bay overnight. Commissioner Holmes inquired what type of occupant might have a problem without overnight parking. Mr. White replied that he is concerned about a late night arrival of someone needing service the following day. Commissioner Erwin inquired if the applicant will be restricting the type of wastes going into the underground tanks. Mr. White replied that the wastes will be monitored to see that the tenants comply with the waste regulations. Commissioner Erwin inquired if the tanks will be secured in any way. Mr. White replied that this has not yet been thought out. It is impractical for each facility to have their own disposal tank. Carltas will comply with the County regulations. Mr. White added that at some time in the future it may be necessary to secure the interior courtyard overnight. -7 :. P, q MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page 9 Commissioner Erwin inquired if securing the courtyard is to protect the vehicle which are left overnight. Mr. White did not know-- only that Carltas would like that option available. There being no other persons desiring to address the Commission on this topic, Chairman McFadden declared the public testimony closed and opened the item for discussion among the Commission members. Chairman McFadden stated that she can go along with the staff recommendation regarding parking. She can also accept the 85% occupancy on Condition 1111 but would like the time extended to nine months. Commissioner Schlehuber would like to see Condition Hll read 85% of the projected 100% occupancy. He can understand the need for overnight parking for service accommodation. Mr. Grimm replied that staff feels it is enough to have parking available in the interior courtyard on Cannon Road, however they could accept the west end; they don't want "A" Street cluttered with overnight parking because it is so visible and would take parking away from the retail tenants. Commissioner Schlehuber inquired if tickets could be issued for cars that park overnight. Mr. Ball, Assistant City Attorney, replied that they could not. Chairman McFadden would like some wording to enable customers to leave a car overnight for servicing but doesn't want to see abandoned vehicles. Commissioner Schlehuber wonders how it would be enforced. Mr. Ball replied that it would be enforced the same as any SDP, i.e. by complaint. Commissioner Marcus inquired who will complain. Mr. Grimm replied that the retail customers could file a complaint. Commissioner Schlehuber feels there should be an 24-hour parking area on the west end, posted with signs, as determined by the Planning Director. Commissioner Marcus can accept modifying Condition 1111 to read the 85% occupancy with a minimum of six months. Chairman McFadden can agree. Chairman McFadden thinks the building looks very nice. She is somewhat concerned that the west view is open and the trees won't cover it for several years. She feels the lunch area is very innovative. Commissioner Schlehuber would like to see staff come up with a future condition requiring larger trees or a variety that will attain their growth faster than ten years. Mr. Grimm replied that this applicant has generously offered to use 24" boxed specimens. Motion was duly made, seconded, and carried to adopt Planning Commission Resolution No. 2775 approving the Negative Declaration issued by the Planning Director and adopt Planning Commission Resolution No. 2776 approving SDP 88-3 based on the findings and subject to the conditions contained therein, and including staff memo dated October 19, 1988, correcting Condition #l to read Condition 1111 and the 100% occupancy revised to 85%, and adding a condition for some overnight parking on the west side to the satisfaction of the Planning Director, and revising Condition #48 to include mylars of the site plan for the City Fire Department. Erwin Holmes Marcus McFadden Schlehuber Schramm K . ;, P T MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page 10 RECESS The Planning Commission recessed at 7:37 p.m. and reconvened at 7:49 p.m. 3) LCPA 88-l(MBLL0 II)/GPA/LU 88-2/ZC 88-4 WILLIAMSON CONTRACT AMRNDMENT 76-1B - CARLTAS RANCH - Request for approval of various related actions to remove approximately 52 acres from the agricultural preserve and add an equal amount of area to the preserve from a different area (land swap) on property located north of Palomar Airport Road and east of Paseo de1 Norte in Local Facilities Management Zone 13. Gary Wayne, Senior Planner, reviewed the background of the request and stated that the Carltas Company has requested an amendment to Agriculture (Ag) Preserve Contract No. 76-l with the City to remove approximately 52 acres of land from the preserve and add and equal amount of area to that preserve from a different portion of their property which is located north of Palomar Airport Road, east of Paseo De1 Norte, and south of Cannon Road in Local Facilities Management Plan Zone 13 as depicted on the location map projected on the east wall of the Council Chamber. In discussing the related actions which are required to effect this action, he stated that the Williamson Act contains a "sunset clause" which permits swaps of agricultural land of equal value prior to January 1, 1989. The applicant tried, without success, to have this date extended. In addition, the Williamson Act requires that the land swap be consistent with the Local Coastal Program (LCP). The LCP currently allows development of approximately 137 acres of the Carltas holdings in exchange for the long-term preservation of agriculture on the remainder of the nearly 500 acre site. However, the LCP requires development to be concentrated along Palomar Airport Road, Paseo de1 Norte, and Cannon Road. Carltas, by amending the Ag-Preserve boundaries, is proposing development be concentrated along the north/south trending ridge. Thus, an LCP amendment is required for consistency in order to allow the amendment to the Williamson Contract. State law also requires that the City's General Plan and zoning be consistent with the LCP. The General Plan does not include a special designation for agriculture. Instead, the Non-Residential Reserve classification designates areas held in reserve for non-residential uses such as agriculture, industrial, commercial, etc. The applicant, therefore, proposes to redesignate the site from a combination of Med Residential (RM) and Non-Residential Reserve (NRR) to a combination of NRR and Open Space (OS). ium In order to provide consistency between the zoning and other +elated actions, it would require a Zone Change from R-A-10,000 and Exclusive Agriculture to Open Space (OS)--the OS designation would be placed over approximately 50 acres of the west facing slope traditionally referred to as the "flower fields"-- Exclusive Agriculture over the reconfigured boundaries of the Ag-Preserve, and Limited Control (L-C) over the remaining developable portion of the site. The Carltas Company claims that without the swap, as proposed, they will be forced to develop the land not protected by the Ag-Preserve Contract and the LCP. This developable area contains the "flower fields." Carltas 4 ;. P f-Y MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION further maintains that it is the desire of the Ecke family (owners of Carltas) to preserve the "flower fields" while allowing adequate development to carry the costs of Palomar Airport Road assessments and anticipated cash needs such as future estate taxes. In requesting priority processing, Carltas offered to place an open space zoning designation over the "flower fields" to ensure their long-term preservation. Staff is especially concerned about the potential negative impact on long term agriculture, the need for buffering of dissimilar land uses, and the commercial development of the ridge top which will have a visual impact. Staff has proposed mitigation measures which would require commercial uses next to primary arterials, and a Q overlay to be placed over the L-C zone which would require an SDP for development of the property. Staff is recommending approval due to the time constraints of the sunset clause and since the proposal will preserve the "flower fields" which are so familiar to residents and tourists alike. Commissioner Schlehuber requested concurrence that the applicant will still be required to meet the requirements of the hillside and parking ordinances before a plan can be approved. Mr. Wayne replied that this was true. In spite of the ability for future planning , staff is concerned that they might be boxed-in by making concessions. He added that the applicant would like to develop the entire ridge but staff sees a problem due to the narrowness of the ridge and the way the development could spill over the slopes to the west. Commissioner Schlehuber wants to know what assurance there is that the open space would be used for floral culture and if there is a way to condition it for that purpose. Mr. Wayne replied that the Master Plan could specify this use. Chairman McFadden inquired about the exact acreage size. Mr. Wayne replied that the graphic is all that is currently available and staff does not yet have the metes and bounds description; however, the applicant has promised it prior to the City Council meeting. The best information staff can provide is that the open space zone comprises approximately 38 acres plus two acres of road. The L-C-Q and EA zones total close to 400 acres. Chairman McFadden inquired of the City attorney if it is possible for the Commission to vote when the details are so vague. Mr. Ball replied that a vote can be taken if the pictorials can be assumed to be accurate enough to determine that the boundaries are presumable. If a wide variation exists, a decision becomes less and less certain. Staff needs to determine if the lines are close to being accurate. Mr. Wayne responded that the large maps which staff has are more accurate than the small graphics which were distributed; he believes the variations on the large topographic maps are only plus or minus three percent. David Hauser, Assistant City Engineer, concurred that the large maps are relatively accurate but that metes and bounds are more precise. Chairman McFadden inquired whether zoning was indicated on the large map; it is her understanding that zoning must be very precise. Mr. Hauser showed Chairman McFadden the large topographic map which had the zoning marked. . L !C- -I MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page Chairman McFadden inquired about the amount of right-of-way for Palomar Airport Road. Mr. Hauser was unsure how much is right-of-way and/or slope easement. Chairman McFadden inquired if Commissioner Schlehuber could accept the maps as precise. He replied that he had visited the site and could accept the maps. Commissioner Erwin has a concern about making the finding regarding fair market value of the property without an appraisal. Mr. Wayne replied that the value was determined by the highest and best use, i.e. the relative value of residential versus non-residential, as was done for the Car Country expansion. Commissioner Erwin inquired if there is anything in writing stating that flowers will be planted. Mr. Wayne replied that there is nothing. Chairman McFadden is concerned about the accuracy of the finding to preserve the "flower fields." Mr. Wayne replied that LCP Finding i/3 deals with dual priorities and specifies a long term agreement to preserve agriculture and the community attraction of the "flower fields." Although there is no assurance that flowers will be grown, the land is currently planted in flowers; the long term agreement ensures that the land will be available for 15 years for agriculture. Chairman McFadden inquired if the General Plan Amendment states that the "flower fields" will be preserved and for how long. Mr. Wayne replied that it is a matter of semantics since the "flower fields" will definitely be preserved. Although there is no guarantee that flowers will be grown, that land which is part of the 52 acre swap will be preserved for agriculture purposes for 15 years. Chairman McFadden inquired if something could be done to ensure that the open space will remain as open space. Mr. Ball replied that there is nothing which can be done to ensure that a particular piece of property will forever remain as open space since zoning is subject to legislative changes. As such, zoning can be changed by a legislative body or by the people. The Williamson Act merely ensures that the land involved in the swap will be used for agriculture for 15 years. Chairman McFadden inquired if an open space easement granted in perpetuity by the owner would accomplish this end. Mr. Ball replied that it would, since an easement is different than zoning. Commissioner Erwin noted that the open space on the map has been construed to be 38 acres plus two acres for the road. He expressed concern that the documentation calls for 50 acres. Mr. Wayne replied that it was his understanding that this would be 50 acres, however, the map actually shows only 38 acres. Chris Calkins, Manager of the Carltas Company, 4401 Manchester, Suite 206, Encinitas, applicant, addressed the Commission and stated that the Ecke family purchased this land over 40 years ago, later purchased water rights, and began truck farming. The Ecke's have attempted to retain the land in floral culture, however, the best land for growing now lays under the freeway to the north (which was taken by . ‘C MINUTES CORRECTED October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page 13 COMMISSIONERS condemnation by the State). The Ecke family is concerned about the heavy development in the coastal area and is attempting to control how their land will be affected. It is ironic that the Williamson Act only affects one piece of property in the entire state--that of this property--and the period to make any changes ends in less than three months. This proposal is for the development of a very small portion of the ranch and the details have been thought out very clearly. The Ecke's are requesting these changes to create a situation which will allow the farming to continue and yet permit other uses. It is felt that development is best at the top of the ridge since it would not inhibit air flow and would not be bothered by pesticides. Chairman McFadden inquired how long the field would remain in flowers. Mr. Calkins replied that it is unknown how long water will be available, how long the soil will hold out, or even if people will continue to purchase flowers. In any event, the Ecke family will be committed to agriculture uses for 15 years and they have an 80 year history. Chairman McFadden noted that one of the reports by an independent expert indicated that the property proposed for development is not the least suitable for farming, with the poorest soil, and that the best area for development is at the northeastern end. Mr. Calkins disagreed with this interpretation and stated that the northeast corner is backed by a steep drop to Macario Canyon and is also bordered by the SDG&E property and that the soils there are good. Commissioner Erwin inquired why development along the ridge trails down the slope to the west instead of the east. Mr. Calkins replied that the end result must be l@ddfiIr! visible since it is proposed for commercial. The development has to be visible in order to have commercial advantage. Development along the ridge and the west slope also allows for the development to blend with the topography. Commissioner Erwin inquired if there are any plans to put a floral auction facility at the Paseo de1 Norte/Palomar Airport Road intersection. Mr. Calkins replied that there are no plans for this purpose at that location. The existing floral auction is a wholesale operation (however, a site is being considered elsewhere in Carlsbad). Carltas hopes to create flowers as an amenity to the commercial development along the ridge. Commissioner Schlehuber noted that the map shows a gradual slope to Palomar Airport Road when, in actuality, there is an abrupt drop. Mr. Calkins replied that plans call for the slope to be redeveloped in order to reconfigure an area for farming. Commissioner Schlehuber inquired if staff has seen a design proposal. Since staff has some concerns about the ridgetop planning, he wonders if it is possible to envision a conceptual development. Mr. Wayne replied that staff had not seen development plans but the shape and location of the developable area along the ridge will make it difficult to develop according to our development standards. Commissioner Schlehuber stated that he wants to make sure the applicant is aware that there are restrictions for development. Mr. Wayne replied that when the Master Plan comes in, the proposal would be reviewed for conformancy with policies and regulations such as the hillside ordinance. . r, /7 MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page Commissioner Schlehuber asked Mr. Calkins if he understands that approval of this application does not constitute a blank check for development. Mr. Calkins replied that he understands this requirement and that the Ecke family would be taking a risk. Commissioner Schramm stated that she has seen a postcard of the "flower fields" in bloom. She wondered if consideration had been given to buildings at the bottom of the property and flowers at the top. Mr. Calkins replied that this plan was considered but due to the soil characteristics and future urban pressures it was deemed better to locate the development at the top of the ridge. In addition, this would permit some control on the location of a north/south road. Commissioner Schramm stated that she has visited the site and noted that the flags seem down very low on the southern portion of the property. The flags appear to be in the middle of the "flower fields." Mr. Calkins replied that the area being proposed for preservation of the "flower fields" is the most visible section of the land. Grading will be necessary, and some consideration had to be given to the commercial aspect of clustering as well as the farming activities. Commissioner Schlehuber noted that there was some allegation that the open space had been reduced from 50 to 40 acres. Mr. Calkins replied that a bubble diagram which was submitted to the Planning Director suggested where the open space would occur. The presentation by Carltas at the City Council meeting suggested approximately 50 acres--specifically, that which is currently being used to cultivate flowers. In actuality, that space is closer to 40 acres than 50. Chairman McFadden opened the public testimony and issued the invitation to speak. There being no persons desiring to address the Commission on this topic, Chairman McFadden declared the public testimony closed and opened the item for discussion among the Commission members. Chairman McFadden stated that she has reservations and feels this proposal is very premature. She doesn't like the island concept and is puzzled about the proposal. She thinks that future Hidden Valley Road to the east will supply the necessary north/south road. She has not been persuaded that the City will even be getting the "flower fields" and thinks the Planning Commission needs to look closely at what the City is getting. Commissioner Schlehuber thinks the City has some built-in protection and that the renderings are merely illustrative. He does not believe there is time for extensive study due to the sunset clause. He feels the City has a lot of protection because the applicant must come back with a Master Plan and at that point the Planning Commission can tie down the flowers. There are ways to build on a ridge and the policies should be looked at. He feels that Ecke is taking all the risk and that the proposal is decent. He can support it. Commissioner Marcus believes that the Master Plan will give some safeguards. However, Carltas might not get one approved-- it could take 15 years. Mr. Wayne responded that the LCP requires a Master Plan to be approved. Commissioner Marcus has many reservations but she can support it. . b MINUTES October 19. 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION page 15 COMMISSIONERS Commissioner Erwin is concerned that the most visible portion at the top will be developed. He is also concerned about the open space reduction from 50 to 40 acres. Also, he can't make the required finding regarding fair market value of the swap since no appraisals were conducted. He cannot support the proposal. Mr. Grimm responded that it is possible for the Planning Commission to move the zone change line further up the ridge to include more of the visible flower fields. Commissioner Schramm would like to see the flowers more along the ridge. It is difficult to approve the swap which will establish the development pattern without seeing a Master Plan. She understands the need to send something to the City Council but would like to see some development arrangement. She commended Carltas on offering the open space but would like to see the additional 10 acres added at the southerly end of the ridge. Chairman McFadden asked the applicant if he could accept this concept. Mr. Calkins could not offer additional open space in the area suggested by Commissioner Schramm. Chairman McFadden inquired as to the reason for nonacceptance. Mr. Calkins replied that if the property is examined closely, he does not feel it is a workable solution since additional fill would be required. Without the additional fill, the buildings would sit in a hole. Commissioner Schramm would like the City Council to look at the proposal to move the open space designation to the ridge. Commissioner Holmes doesn't feel anything can be accomplished without a Master Plan. He would like to recommend that the applicant return with a Master Plan. Chairman McFadden concurs. Motion was duly made, seconded, and carried to deny the application. DISCUSSION ITEMS: 5) Request to address the Planning Commissioner - MIRE RYAN. Finding that product change in units is in substantial conformance with CT 85-21. Charles Grimm stated that by letter to Michael Holzmiller dated October 17, 1988, the applicant has requested that this item be moved to the November 2, 1988 agenda. Motion was duly made, seconded, and carried to move this item to the November 2, 1988 agenda as requested by the applicant. Chairman McFadden requested staff to provide some written material on this item in the meeting packets. Erwin Holmes Marcus McFadden Schlehuber Schramm Erwin Holmes Marcus McFadden Schlehuber Schramm . + ? MINUTES October 19, 1988 PLANNING COMMISSION Page 16 ADDED ITEMS AND REPORTS: Chairman McFadden announced that the terms of Commissioners Schramm, Hall, and McFadden to the Design Review Board were expiring. Motion was duly made, seconded, and carried to reappoint Commissioners Schramm, Hall, and McFadden to a new term on the Design Review Board. Commissioner Erwin requested that the current parking lot ordinance be placed on the next agenda as a discussion item. Motion was duly made , seconded, and carried to place the Parking Lot Ordinance on the agenda for November 2, 1988 as a discussion item. Commissioner Schramm requested an additional discussion item--a review of the Hillside Ordinance as it pertains to ridgetop development. MINUTES: The Planning Commission approved the minutes of October 5, 1988 as presented. ADJOURNMENT: By proper motion, the meeting of October 19, 1988 was adjourned at 9:27 p.m. Respectfully submitted, MICHAEL HOLZMILLER Planning Director BETTY BUCKNER Minutes Clerk MINUTES ARE ALSO TAPED AND KEPT ON FILE UNTIL THE MINUTES ARE APPROVED. Erwin Holmes Marcus McFadden Schlehuber Schramm Erwin Holmes Marcus McFadden Schlehuber Schramm Erwin Holmes Marcus McFadden Schlehuber Schramm Erwin Holmes Marcus McFadden Schlehuber Schramm 4 d%&‘@# CONSULTANTS CIVIL ENGINEERING PLANNING PROCESSING SURVEYING 7750-2H EL CAMINO REAL RANCH0 LA COSTA CARLSBAD, CALIFORNIA 92009 PHONE 619/944-1010 FAX: 944-7840 October 19, 1988 Planning Commission Members City of Carlsbad 2075 Las Palmas Drive Carlsbad, California 92008 RE: Zone 22 Facilities Plan - Open Space Dear Commissioners: I am part owner of one of the properties located within Facility Zone 22. In 1986 we applied for, and were granted a re-zone on our 9 acres which changed 5+ of these 9 acres to open space as a condition of re-zoning the remainder to office use. Exhibits 50 and 51, and the open space text of the proposed Zone 22 facility plan, show our property providing 40,000 square feet of additional open space. (owner #2 - O/Day page 114) It is my understanding, and I would like confirmation, that the text and these exhibits are only examples of how open space could be provided and that it is not a condition of our site plan, and, that the individual site plan open space requirements will be determined when the site plan for this property is reviewed. Thank your for your consideration. Very Truly Yours, cc Mr. Phil Carter